From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Wed Aug 1 00:47:20 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (James Lee) Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 16:47:20 -0700 Subject: Newbie: Problems with my homepage Message-ID: <11EC3A0EF482D311ABD40008C7E64C7009D3132E@diana.portal.com> This can happen if you enable News Items but none have been posted. If you have News Items enabled, try disabling it and see if you get the homepage back. -----Original Message----- From: Lou Fox [mailto:foulox@yahoo.com] Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2001 3:40 PM To: manila-newbies@userland.com Subject: Newbie: Problems with my homepage My homepage is messed up. Here are my problems: It has a calendar for May 1999, instead of today's I have it set to show 7 news days, it shows today's date, and no news stories. But if I click on the archive button for today's date then it has the homepage the way I would like it to appear I have an editing form turned on for the home page, yet none appears. I've tried various themes none of them help What did I screw up, and how do I fix it? Any assistance will be greatly appreciated. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger http://phonecard.yahoo.com/ From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Wed Aug 1 02:14:09 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Brett Young) Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2001 13:14:09 +1200 Subject: help with site structure Message-ID: <005201c11a27$444824f0$250a0a0a@brett> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0053_01C11A8B.D97D04F0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Having trouble getting my head round this. Want to set up a site structure so that my pages(stories) all get rendered when I statically render the while site. =20 My understanding is that if I set up my pages in the site structure under a category (without its ownmsgnum) then: 1. new pages will automatically be added into the site structure and 2. all the pages will be rendered rather than just the home page (as at present) =20 so I did this for the navigation and site structure areas of the prefs: =20 =20 =20 =20 Main Page shows as a navigation link but when I press it I get=20 =20 Sorry! There was an error: There is no folder or object database named "mainpage" in the folder "C:\WINNT\Profiles\Administrator\Desktop\Frontier 6.2.1\Guest Databases\www\". =20 I must be doing this wrong (for sure)=85 =20 Can anyone assist please? =20 Brett Young =20 ------=_NextPart_000_0053_01C11A8B.D97D04F0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Having trouble getting my head round this. Want to = set up a site structure so that my pages(stories) all = get rendered when I statically render the while = site.

My understanding is that if I set up my pages in the = site structure under a category (without its ownmsgnum) then:

new pages will automatically be added into the site structure = and
all the pages will be rendered rather than just the home page (as at = present)

so I did = this for the navigation and site structure areas of the prefs:

=A0=A0 = <item name=3D"Home" pagename=3D"/brett/"/>

=A0=A0 = <item name=3D"Main Page" pagename=3D"/mainpage/"/>

=A0=A0 = </navigator>

</category>

=A0 = </hierarchy>

Main Page shows as a navigation link but when I press = it I get

Sorry! There was an error: There is no folder or object database named "mainpage" in the folder "C:\WINNT\Profiles\Administrator\Desktop\Frontier 6.2.1\Guest Databases\www\".

I must be doing = this wrong (for sure)…

Can anyone assist = please?

Brett = Young

------=_NextPart_000_0053_01C11A8B.D97D04F0-- From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Thu Aug 2 08:02:50 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Richard E. Brown) Date: 02 Aug 2001 03:02:50 EDT Subject: Searchable Mailing list archive/FAQ Message-ID: <83770@blitz1.dartware.com> Folks: I am looking for two features, preferably tied together with a single search function: 1) A mailing list archive program. (Note, I don't need the mailing list program; just an archiver of all the messages.) 2) A FAQ creation utility, preferably web-based. 3) A web search facility that would search both at once. Anyone know of a solution that would do this? (Obviously, I'm rooting for Frontier/Manila...) Thanks! Rich Brown richard.e.brown@dartware.com Dartware, LLC http://www.dartware.com 25 S. Main St, PO Box 130 Telephone: 603-643-2268 Hanover, NH 03755-0130 USA Fax: 603-643-2289 From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Thu Aug 2 19:10:47 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Bob Raiselis) Date: Thu, 2 Aug 2001 14:10:47 -0400 Subject: Search Engines Message-ID: <20010802181047.13152@pop.valley.net> I've followed the excellent instructions at http://frontier.userland.com/stories/storyReader$3041 for setting up our copy of Frontier/Manila so that it can act as a search engine for the sites we host. Trick is, can you not limit searches to single sites? If we host half a dozen Manila sites, do I have to see all of the instances of the word "bandaid" when I do my search? I only want to see the ones that occur on the Bandaid site. Bob From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Tue Aug 7 18:03:14 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Ceelee) Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 10:03:14 -0700 Subject: Can't edit msg with Netscape Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20010807095500.00a66d40@vs2.netalyst.net> A contributing editor who uses Netscape alerted me to a new problem. The following problem appears only when editing with the Netscape browser. (Internet Explorer is fine.) The "Post Changes" button overlays the text box, as do ALL the metadata fields. And even if I could see through the button to edit, it is inactive. I reproduced this problem from my machine - Windows 98, 800x600 resolution, Netscape Communicator 4.61. This problem has appeared since we started using metadata now on our staff site. (Metadata works fine, btw.) Our short term solution to the Netscape problem is to use IE instead. But with browser-based editing, it's best if folks can use either Netscape or IE. Also, this makes me wary about using metadata on other manila sites I manage. Hope you have a lead on this. -Ceelee From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Tue Aug 7 18:11:29 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (David A. Bayly) Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 18:11:29 +0100 Subject: Can't edit msg with Netscape In-Reply-To: <5.0.2.1.2.20010807095500.00a66d40@vs2.netalyst.net> References: <5.0.2.1.2.20010807095500.00a66d40@vs2.netalyst.net> Message-ID: This is almost certainly a table error and most likely in your template. Suggestion, if you have access to a Macintosh, then try the iCab browser[1] and use its superior error detection and reporting abilities to debug the template html. [1] . >A contributing editor who uses Netscape alerted me to a new problem. >The following problem appears only when editing with the Netscape >browser. (Internet Explorer is fine.) > >The "Post Changes" button overlays the text box, as do ALL the >metadata fields. And even if I could see through the button to edit, >it is inactive. > >I reproduced this problem from my machine - Windows 98, 800x600 >resolution, Netscape Communicator 4.61. > >This problem has appeared since we started using metadata now on our >staff site. (Metadata works fine, btw.) Our short term solution to >the Netscape problem is to use IE instead. But with browser-based >editing, it's best if folks can use either Netscape or IE. Also, >this makes me wary about using metadata on other manila sites I >manage. > >Hope you have a lead on this. >-Ceelee -- - David Bayly. Programmer and digest reader. dbayly at udena dot ch Digest Readers do it once a day. From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Tue Aug 7 18:32:48 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Peter Harbeson) Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 13:32:48 -0400 Subject: Can't edit msg with Netscape Message-ID: The way Netscape lays out pages can differ greatly from Explorer, particularly if you're using Cascading Style Sheets or complex tables. The real problem is probably in the Netscape browser, which does not properly conform to W3C standards. (IE is not 100% compliant, but it's much better). It's also possible that the problem is in your tagging; IE is much more forgiving of problems in tagging, particularly in tables. Some possible solutions: - simplify the tables in your template - if you're using CSS to position page elements, consider creating two separate style sheets, one that works in IE and one that works in Netscape. Then you'll need to detect the user's browser and swap in the correct CSS. (I haven't implemented this yet in Frontier, but it's easy with PHP, so I think it will be doable.) - recommend that users use Internet Explorer (I don't like this solution, but it can be at least a stopgap) FWIW, I've found that some of the templates distributed with Manila do not render properly in Netscape. Even some of the pages at Userland.com aren't right. Additional bad news: 1. There are more browsers than just IE and Netscape. Opera and iCab are pretty standards-compliant. I just started testing with Mozilla and Konqueror, so I'm not sure. The W3C has a browser called Amaya as well, but I believe it's more intended for testing than use. 2. Pages also render differently on the Windows and Mac versions of the SAME browser. This is primarily a font size problem, but there are some other subtle differences. > A contributing editor who uses Netscape alerted me to a new problem. The > following problem appears only when editing with the Netscape browser. > (Internet Explorer is fine.) > > The "Post Changes" button overlays the text box, as do ALL the metadata > fields. And even if I could see through the button to edit, it is inactive. > > I reproduced this problem from my machine - Windows 98, 800x600 resolution, > Netscape Communicator 4.61. > > This problem has appeared since we started using metadata now on our staff > site. (Metadata works fine, btw.) Our short term solution to the Netscape > problem is to use IE instead. But with browser-based editing, it's best if > folks can use either Netscape or IE. Also, this makes me wary about using > metadata on other manila sites I manage. > > Hope you have a lead on this. > -Ceelee > > > > -- Peter J. Harbeson Infoliage Communication http://www.infoliage.com From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Tue Aug 7 19:00:28 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Ceelee) Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 11:00:28 -0700 Subject: Can't edit msg with Netscape In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20010807105647.00a2ec70@vs2.netalyst.net> Thanks David & Peter, Yes ... definitely a template problem. No problem editing with Netscape on one of our sites that uses both metadata and the ThickLines theme. The site with the problems doesn't use a theme, but starts with a customized version of the default Manila template. I'll compare the two and work from there. -Lee At 10:32 AM 08/07/2001, you wrote: >The way Netscape lays out pages can differ greatly from Explorer, >particularly if you're using Cascading Style Sheets or complex tables. >The real problem is probably in the Netscape browser, which does not >properly conform to W3C standards. (IE is not 100% compliant, but it's >much better). It's also possible that the problem is in your tagging; >IE is much more forgiving of problems in tagging, particularly in >tables. > >Some possible solutions: > - simplify the tables in your template > - if you're using CSS to position page elements, consider creating two >separate style sheets, one that works in IE and one that works in >Netscape. Then you'll need to detect the user's browser and swap in the >correct CSS. (I haven't implemented this yet in Frontier, but it's easy >with PHP, so I think it will be doable.) > - recommend that users use Internet Explorer (I don't like this >solution, but it can be at least a stopgap) > >FWIW, I've found that some of the templates distributed with Manila do >not render properly in Netscape. Even some of the pages at Userland.com >aren't right. > >Additional bad news: > 1. There are more browsers than just IE and Netscape. Opera and iCab >are pretty standards-compliant. I just started testing with Mozilla and >Konqueror, so I'm not sure. The W3C has a browser called Amaya as well, >but I believe it's more intended for testing than use. > 2. Pages also render differently on the Windows and Mac versions of >the SAME browser. This is primarily a font size problem, but there are >some other subtle differences. > > > A contributing editor who uses Netscape alerted me to a new problem. >The > > following problem appears only when editing with the Netscape >browser. > > (Internet Explorer is fine.) > > > > The "Post Changes" button overlays the text box, as do ALL the >metadata > > fields. And even if I could see through the button to edit, it is >inactive. > > > > I reproduced this problem from my machine - Windows 98, 800x600 >resolution, > > Netscape Communicator 4.61. > > > > This problem has appeared since we started using metadata now on our >staff > > site. (Metadata works fine, btw.) Our short term solution to the >Netscape > > problem is to use IE instead. But with browser-based editing, it's >best if > > folks can use either Netscape or IE. Also, this makes me wary about >using > > metadata on other manila sites I manage. > > > > Hope you have a lead on this. > > -Ceelee > > > > > > > > > >-- >Peter J. Harbeson >Infoliage Communication >http://www.infoliage.com From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Tue Aug 7 22:08:48 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (R. Scott Granneman) Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 16:08:48 -0500 Subject: Can't edit msg with Netscape References: <5.0.2.1.2.20010807105647.00a2ec70@vs2.netalyst.net> Message-ID: <3B7058E0.8040001@granneman.com> How about using Mozilla 0.9.3, which is Netscape without all the AOL lard? It's a great browser, and even though it's beta, it's pretty darn solid. I use it every day, all day, on Linux & Windows, & it's great. Scott -- R. Scott Granneman scott@granneman.com ~ www.granneman.com Join GranneNotes! Information at www.granneman.com I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work. --- Thomas Edison Ceelee wrote: > Thanks David & Peter, > Yes ... definitely a template problem. > No problem editing with Netscape on one of our sites that uses both > metadata and the ThickLines theme. > The site with the problems doesn't use a theme, but starts with a > customized version of the default Manila template. I'll compare the two > and work from there. > -Lee > > At 10:32 AM 08/07/2001, you wrote: > >> The way Netscape lays out pages can differ greatly from Explorer, >> particularly if you're using Cascading Style Sheets or complex tables. >> The real problem is probably in the Netscape browser, which does not >> properly conform to W3C standards. (IE is not 100% compliant, but it's >> much better). It's also possible that the problem is in your tagging; >> IE is much more forgiving of problems in tagging, particularly in >> tables. >> >> Some possible solutions: >> - simplify the tables in your template >> - if you're using CSS to position page elements, consider creating two >> separate style sheets, one that works in IE and one that works in >> Netscape. Then you'll need to detect the user's browser and swap in the >> correct CSS. (I haven't implemented this yet in Frontier, but it's easy >> with PHP, so I think it will be doable.) >> - recommend that users use Internet Explorer (I don't like this >> solution, but it can be at least a stopgap) >> >> FWIW, I've found that some of the templates distributed with Manila do >> not render properly in Netscape. Even some of the pages at Userland.com >> aren't right. >> >> Additional bad news: >> 1. There are more browsers than just IE and Netscape. Opera and iCab >> are pretty standards-compliant. I just started testing with Mozilla and >> Konqueror, so I'm not sure. The W3C has a browser called Amaya as well, >> but I believe it's more intended for testing than use. >> 2. Pages also render differently on the Windows and Mac versions of >> the SAME browser. This is primarily a font size problem, but there are >> some other subtle differences. >> >> > A contributing editor who uses Netscape alerted me to a new problem. >> The >> > following problem appears only when editing with the Netscape >> browser. >> > (Internet Explorer is fine.) >> > >> > The "Post Changes" button overlays the text box, as do ALL the >> metadata >> > fields. And even if I could see through the button to edit, it is >> inactive. >> > >> > I reproduced this problem from my machine - Windows 98, 800x600 >> resolution, >> > Netscape Communicator 4.61. >> > >> > This problem has appeared since we started using metadata now on our >> staff >> > site. (Metadata works fine, btw.) Our short term solution to the >> Netscape >> > problem is to use IE instead. But with browser-based editing, it's >> best if >> > folks can use either Netscape or IE. Also, this makes me wary about >> using >> > metadata on other manila sites I manage. >> > >> > Hope you have a lead on this. >> > -Ceelee From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Thu Aug 9 06:53:55 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Dan Geiser) Date: Thu, 09 Aug 2001 01:53:55 -0400 Subject: Search Prefs Done, What Next? Message-ID: Hello, All, Using this page... http://search.editthispage.com/howTo ...I have went through the process of enabling my search prefs. Even though the example listed the Search Engine Server as Search.Userland.Com I set it to Search.EditThisPage.Com because I saw some other weblogs doing it that way. Question #1: Is it ok to use that as the search enginge server? Or should I use Search.Userland.Com or even Search.ManilaSites.Com? After the prefs are setup the HowTo says... ======================================================================== Now your site is searchable The next step is to let the search engine know about your site. You can do that by editing your home page. Then visit the Sites page. Your site should show up in the list. ======================================================================== Question #2: How do I let the search engine know about my site? It doesn't give any indicator whatsoever how am I supposed to edit my home page to do this? Thanks In Advance, Dan Geiser http://bitstream.manilasites.com/ _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Fri Aug 10 03:38:38 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Dan Geiser) Date: Thu, 09 Aug 2001 22:38:38 -0400 Subject: /stats/ Message-ID: Hello, All, Since my last question went over so well I thought I'd post another one. Does anyone know if there is a list somwhere of all of the different paths on a standard Manila directory structure? For example, I can see which web sites refered hits to me by using viewing this URL... http://bitstream.manilasites.com/stats/referers I would be interested in knowing if there are other stats I can look at. Thanks, Much! Dan Geiser _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Fri Aug 10 04:12:50 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Nick Young) Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2001 15:12:50 +1200 Subject: /stats/ References: Message-ID: <029801c1214a$61c0b400$0207a8c0@COMPUTER> here's some stats/MostReadMessages stats/hourlyhits stats/members /prefs ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dan Geiser" To: Sent: Friday, August 10, 2001 2:38 PM Subject: /stats/ Hello, All, Since my last question went over so well I thought I'd post another one. Does anyone know if there is a list somwhere of all of the different paths on a standard Manila directory structure? For example, I can see which web sites refered hits to me by using viewing this URL... http://bitstream.manilasites.com/stats/referers I would be interested in knowing if there are other stats I can look at. Thanks, Much! Dan Geiser _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Fri Aug 10 13:58:00 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Ken Dow) Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2001 08:58:00 -0400 Subject: /stats/ In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: >Since my last question went over so well I thought I'd post another >one. Does anyone know if there is a list somwhere of all of the >different paths on a standard Manila directory structure? It's at http://manilanewbies.userland.com/usersguide/admin/pageaddresses. HTH. -- Regards, Ken @ http://www.kendow.com The mystery of life is not a problem to be solved, it is a reality to be lived. - Van Der Leeuwarden From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Fri Aug 10 17:29:17 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Scott Michael) Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2001 11:29:17 -0500 Subject: Theme Format Message-ID: i'm looking for information about the format of manila theme files. i know the files are saved as 'fat pages' - which seems to be a method of encoding binary data into xml. so what i'm really looking for is some documentation on how the "pageData" element of these files is encoded and decoded. dave winer assured me: "Yup, it's open and documented. Ask on one of the mail lists for a pointer." so that's what i'm doing. i sincerely appreciate any information you can provide. peace, scott. From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Fri Aug 10 17:24:02 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Ken Dow) Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2001 12:24:02 -0400 Subject: ANN: Manila Training in San Jose, September 10th Message-ID: A reminder that I'm offering the following Manila courses in San Jose, CA starting on Monday, September 10th: * Introduction to Manila * A one day, hands-on course on starting and working with a Manila Web site. * Mastering Manila * A two day, hands-on course on designing and managing a Manila Web site. * Manila Server Administration * A two day, hands-on course on installing and administering a Manila server. The deadline for registration is August 24th. You can find out more at http://www.kendow.com/manilacourses.html. -- Regards / Ken Tell me and I forget. Show me and I remember. Involve me and I understand. - Chinese proverb From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Tue Aug 14 14:45:44 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Jim Byrne) Date: Tue, 14 Aug 2001 14:45:44 +0100 Subject: delete news items? Message-ID: Hi, How do I delete a Manila news item after I have posted it? Thanks, Jim -- Jim Byrne Project Director, The Making Connections Unit, Glasgow Caledonian University, Glasgow G4 OBA, 0141 331 3893 Everything you need to know about publishing accessible information on the Web. Connections Disability: http://www.connections.gcal.ac.uk/ Scottish Disability Information Mailing list: http://www.connections.gcal.ac.uk/MailList/DisList.html From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Wed Aug 15 00:09:13 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Dylan) Date: Tue, 14 Aug 2001 16:09:13 -0700 Subject: Versioning - Visual Source Safe? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hello, everybody. My company is currently evaluating Frontier and Manilla, and one of our rigid constraints before acceptance is some sort of version control integration. Knowing Manilla to be just about the most open and extensible software I've encountered, there must be some way to integrate the editing of pages (gems as well?) with a versioning system like VSS or CVS. Can anyone provide any information about this? Hints? Documents? Full-blown tutorials? Yes it is possible / No it is not possible Thanks, Dylan Parker From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Wed Aug 15 12:02:12 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Steve Hooker) Date: Wed, 15 Aug 2001 12:02:12 +0100 Subject: delete news items? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: on 14/08/01 2:45 pm, Jim Byrne at j.byrne@gcal.ac.uk wrote: > How do I delete a Manila news item after I have posted it? it's by then a message, find its number and delete it normally. -- Steve Business blog - http://www.cyberSaps.com/ NEW Sex blog - http://steve.sexblogs.com/ Personal blog - http://www.myprotova.com/steve/ Although I don't like football... Get a Villa blog - http://astonvilla.blogfootball.com/create Even the BBC thinks it's all very neat... http://www.bbc.co.uk/webwise/guides/easyweb/easyweb2.shtml From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Thu Aug 16 17:27:11 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Jim Byrne) Date: Thu, 16 Aug 2001 17:27:11 +0100 Subject: Versioning - Visual Source Safe? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: on 15/8/01 12:09 am, Dylan at dylan@mindstech.com wrote: > Hello, everybody. > > My company is currently evaluating Frontier and Manilla, and one of our > rigid constraints before acceptance is some sort of version control > integration. > > Knowing Manilla to be just about the most open and extensible software I've > encountered, there must be some way to integrate the editing of pages (gems > as well?) with a versioning system like VSS or CVS. > > Can anyone provide any information about this? Hints? Documents? Full-blown > tutorials? > > Yes it is possible / No it is not possible > > Thanks, > Dylan Parker > > Dylan, I don't know how it is implemented but there is versioning built in for editing of pages. If one person is editing a page - it is not possible for someone else to edit it. Click on the Admin menu and scroll down to the bottom of the page - you will see a section called 'Custody'. Find out more about Custody here: http://weblogs.userland.com/manilaNewbies/usersguide/admin/custody All the best, Jim -- Jim Byrne Project Director, The Making Connections Unit, Glasgow Caledonian University, Glasgow G4 OBA, 0141 331 3893 Everything you need to know about publishing accessible information on the Web. Connections Disability: http://www.connections.gcal.ac.uk/ Scottish Disability Information Mailing list: http://www.connections.gcal.ac.uk/MailList/DisList.html From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Thu Aug 16 17:56:15 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Dylan) Date: Thu, 16 Aug 2001 09:56:15 -0700 Subject: Versioning - Visual Source Safe? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Dylan, > > I don't know how it is implemented but there is versioning built in for > editing of pages. If one person is editing a page - it is not > possible for > someone else to edit it. Click on the Admin menu and scroll down to the > bottom of the page - you will see a section called 'Custody'. > > Find out more about Custody here: > http://weblogs.userland.com/manilaNewbies/usersguide/admin/custody > > All the best, > Jim > Thanks for the info Jim. I was aware of the locking mechanism built into Manila, but I think we are looking for a bit more control and finer granularity. The concern is that someone may do damage to a page and we will want to rollback a few revisions... and ideally LOOK at all the revisions before we update. Some sort of integration with Visual Source Safe (ahh! Microsoft) or CVS would be able to do this. I've been digging deeper into the specifics of UserTalk, and Manila as an application within Frontier etc... and I'm quite astounded! Everything is right there.. =) I think I may have figured a way to do what I want... effectively adding to the custody.checkIn and checkOut scripts in manila.root... I'm thinking that I should be able to make command-line calls to SourceSafe and copy around content as needed. An idea anyways... Another possible approach might be something that works with static rendering. Once the files are on disk, it is even easier to do some sort of revision control... So many choices... and it's not really even my project to be working on this... I just can't resist! =) Thanks again. Dylan Parker From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Fri Aug 17 14:58:52 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Ken Dow) Date: Fri, 17 Aug 2001 09:58:52 -0400 Subject: Versioning - Visual Source Safe? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Dylan, >The concern is that someone may do damage to a page and we will want to >rollback a few revisions... and ideally LOOK at all the revisions before we >update. Manila can write XML versions of every changed message to a folder hierarchy on disk. They are broken out by Manila site and organized by date. So the following file: Frontier > Guest Databases > Ops > Discuss Archive > createASiteManilaWebsiteDiscuss > 2001 > 03 > 05 > 0000006.0004.xml Represents the 4th edit of message 6 in the createASite site and might look like this:

6 HQ Search Me@KenDow.Com Thu, 22 Feb 2001 15:11:16 GMT 17 0 createASiteStories

{counterMacros.pagecounter()} {workspace.sampleSearch (altColor:"beige", flShowSiteNames:false)} Perhaps you could import these XML files into your version control system? Note that this feature has to be enabled from the Frontier Control Panel. HTH. -- Regards, Ken @ http://www.kendow.com The mystery of life is not a problem to be solved, it is a reality to be lived. - Van Der Leeuwarden From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Fri Aug 17 10:37:18 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Don Saklad) Date: Fri, 17 Aug 2001 05:37:18 -0400 Subject: How to define stories. How to define news. Message-ID: It's not yet crystal clear what the differences are between stories and news. Improved definitions are needed for stories and news that distinguish what are stories and what are news better. A proper definition of a term would not use that same term in its definition. 1. What exactly are the features of stories versus the features of news?... 2. What are some of the things to consider in choosing one or the other?... 3. How would they be combined?... 4. Who are experts that could elaborate on stories and news ambiguities more precisely?... Cheers! and kind regards, oo__ don don@saklad.org http://GuideToProblematicalLibraryUse.WebLogs.com http://NotB4WeKnow.EditThisPage.com http://BifidRib.ManilaSites.com From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Mon Aug 27 14:29:51 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Bob Kemp) Date: Mon, 27 Aug 2001 14:29:51 +0100 Subject: Problem changing style sheet in template Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20010827104503.00abcda0@pop-hub.strath.ac.uk> Hi all, Just a little thing, but it's frustrating me: I'm trying to change colors in one of the templates, MinimalWhite, via the CSS style sheet. I've managed this successfully for other selectors, but changing the .siteName class is proving impossible. .siteName has these properties: font-size: 42px; font-weight: bold; color: #999999; Changes to font-size and font-weight take effect as expected, but changes to color don't. I've had a look through the ManilaWebsites.root to see if there's anything there which sheds light on the matter, with no success - but I'm no Frontier expert. Has anyone got any suggestions as to what's going on and what I can do about it? Thanks in anticipation, Bob Kemp From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Mon Aug 27 16:08:15 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Jim Byrne) Date: Mon, 27 Aug 2001 16:08:15 +0100 Subject: Problem changing style sheet in template In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20010827104503.00abcda0@pop-hub.strath.ac.uk> Message-ID: on 27/8/01 2:29 pm, Bob Kemp at robert.kemp@strath.ac.uk wrote: > Hi all, > > Just a little thing, but it's frustrating me: > > I'm trying to change colors in one of the templates, MinimalWhite, via the > CSS style sheet. I've managed this successfully for other selectors, but > changing the .siteName class is proving impossible. > > .siteName has these properties: > > font-size: 42px; > font-weight: bold; > color: #999999; > > Changes to font-size and font-weight take effect as expected, but changes > to color don't. I've had a look through the ManilaWebsites.root to see if > there's anything there which sheds light on the matter, with no success - > but I'm no Frontier expert. > > Has anyone got any suggestions as to what's going on and what I can do > about it? > > Thanks in anticipation, > > Bob Kemp > > Bob, The title of the site at the top of the page is a link - and the colors of the links are set in the body tag. You might want to just make the title of your site standard text rather than linked text. Allt he best, Jim -- Jim Byrne Project Director, The Making Connections Unit, Glasgow Caledonian University, Glasgow G4 OBA, 0141 331 3893 Everything you need to know about publishing accessible information on the Web. Connections Disability: http://www.connections.gcal.ac.uk/ Scottish Disability Information Mailing list: http://www.connections.gcal.ac.uk/MailList/DisList.html From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Tue Aug 28 13:12:50 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Bob Kemp) Date: Tue, 28 Aug 2001 13:12:50 +0100 Subject: Problem changing style sheet in template In-Reply-To: References: <5.1.0.14.0.20010827104503.00abcda0@pop-hub.strath.ac.uk> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20010828131044.00ac6b10@pop-hub.strath.ac.uk> Thanks Jim - that worked. Cheers, Bob Kemp At 04:08 PM 8/27/01 +0100, you wrote: >on 27/8/01 2:29 pm, Bob Kemp at robert.kemp@strath.ac.uk wrote: > > > Hi all, > > > > Just a little thing, but it's frustrating me: > > > > I'm trying to change colors in one of the templates, MinimalWhite, via the > > CSS style sheet. I've managed this successfully for other selectors, but > > changing the .siteName class is proving impossible. > > > > .siteName has these properties: > > > > font-size: 42px; > > font-weight: bold; > > color: #999999; > > > > Changes to font-size and font-weight take effect as expected, but changes > > to color don't. I've had a look through the ManilaWebsites.root to see if > > there's anything there which sheds light on the matter, with no success - > > but I'm no Frontier expert. > > > > Has anyone got any suggestions as to what's going on and what I can do > > about it? > > > > Thanks in anticipation, > > > > Bob Kemp > > > > >Bob, > >The title of the site at the top of the page is a link - and the colors of >the links are set in the body tag. You might want to just make the title of >your site standard text rather than linked text. > >Allt he best, >Jim > > > >-- >Jim Byrne Project Director, The Making Connections Unit, Glasgow Caledonian >University, Glasgow G4 OBA, 0141 331 3893 > >Everything you need to know about publishing accessible information on the >Web. > >Connections Disability: http://www.connections.gcal.ac.uk/ > >Scottish Disability Information Mailing list: >http://www.connections.gcal.ac.uk/MailList/DisList.html From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Tue Aug 28 14:52:15 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Bob Kemp) Date: Tue, 28 Aug 2001 14:52:15 +0100 Subject: Brackets on html tags don't render... Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20010828142506.00abbd10@pop-hub.strath.ac.uk> Hi again everyone, Another little problem: I'm trying to import another site into my Manila site, and doing so simply by making new stories and cutting and pasting the html into them. Unfortunately the html doesn't render consistently doing this. Opening brackets for html tags are rendered as < - but not always. Sometimes they work just fine. I was prepared to put up with this little idiosyncracy and edit the brackets by hand, but I've now found that when I restore the opening bracket and post the changes, < is still there to haunt me. I suspect this is an XML-related problem - something to do with interpreting less-than literally? Can anyone suggest how to deal with it? Thanks, Bob Kemp From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Tue Aug 28 15:13:48 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Ken Dow) Date: Tue, 28 Aug 2001 10:13:48 -0400 Subject: Brackets on html tags don't render... In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20010828142506.00abbd10@pop-hub.strath.ac.uk> References: <5.1.0.14.0.20010828142506.00abbd10@pop-hub.strath.ac.uk> Message-ID: Bob, >Another little problem: I'm trying to import another site into my >Manila site, and doing so simply by making new stories and cutting >and pasting the html into them. Unfortunately the html doesn't >render consistently doing this. Opening brackets for html tags are >rendered as < - but not always. Sometimes they work just fine. It sounds like the Prefs > Legal Tags settings aren't the same on the new site so illegal tags are being neutered. -- Regards, Ken @ http://www.kendow.com The mystery of life is not a problem to be solved, it is a reality to be lived. - Van Der Leeuwarden From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Tue Aug 28 15:20:47 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Jim Byrne) Date: Tue, 28 Aug 2001 15:20:47 +0100 Subject: Brackets on html tags don't render... In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20010828142506.00abbd10@pop-hub.strath.ac.uk> Message-ID: on 28/8/01 2:52 pm, Bob Kemp at robert.kemp@strath.ac.uk wrote: > Hi again everyone, > > Another little problem: I'm trying to import another site into my Manila > site, and doing so simply by making new stories and cutting and pasting the > html into them. Unfortunately the html doesn't render consistently doing > this. Opening brackets for html tags are rendered as < - but not always. > Sometimes they work just fine. > > I was prepared to put up with this little idiosyncracy and edit the > brackets by hand, but I've now found that when I restore the opening > bracket and post the changes, < is still there to haunt me. I suspect > this is an XML-related problem - something to do with interpreting > less-than literally? Can anyone suggest how to deal with it? > > Thanks, > > Bob Kemp > > Bob, Check that you are not using HTML which is not been specified as legal for your Manila site (see Prefs/Legal Tags). Also check that there are no mistakes in your HTML (including the HTML in your template) and that the syntax of all your macros is correct. Jim -- Jim Byrne Project Director, The Making Connections Unit, Glasgow Caledonian University, Glasgow G4 OBA, 0141 331 3893 Everything you need to know about publishing accessible information on the Web. Connections Disability: http://www.connections.gcal.ac.uk/ Scottish Disability Information Mailing list: http://www.connections.gcal.ac.uk/MailList/DisList.html From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Tue Aug 28 16:14:46 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Bob Kemp) Date: Tue, 28 Aug 2001 16:14:46 +0100 Subject: Brackets on html tags don't render... In-Reply-To: References: <5.1.0.14.0.20010828142506.00abbd10@pop-hub.strath.ac.uk> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20010828160843.00abfb50@pop-hub.strath.ac.uk> Jim, Ken, Thanks for your quick responses. A significant part of the problem appears to be caused by the legal tags aspect. I found one tag which was not checked in the Prefs, Legal Tags list. Checking this reduced the problem, but it now appears that my use of "class=" to call selectors defined in the CSS style sheet is causing trouble. And "class=" doesn't feature in the Legal Tags list. I'm busy checking my html for further gremlins.... Thanks again, Bob Kemp >on 28/8/01 2:52 pm, Bob Kemp at robert.kemp@strath.ac.uk wrote: > > > Hi again everyone, > > > > Another little problem: I'm trying to import another site into my Manila > > site, and doing so simply by making new stories and cutting and pasting the > > html into them. Unfortunately the html doesn't render consistently doing > > this. Opening brackets for html tags are rendered as < - but not always. > > Sometimes they work just fine. > > > > I was prepared to put up with this little idiosyncracy and edit the > > brackets by hand, but I've now found that when I restore the opening > > bracket and post the changes, < is still there to haunt me. I suspect > > this is an XML-related problem - something to do with interpreting > > less-than literally? Can anyone suggest how to deal with it? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Bob Kemp > > > > >Bob, > >Check that you are not using HTML which is not been specified as legal for >your Manila site (see Prefs/Legal Tags). Also check that there are no >mistakes in your HTML (including the HTML in your template) and that the >syntax of all your macros is correct. > >Jim > > >-- >Jim Byrne Project Director, The Making Connections Unit, Glasgow Caledonian >University, Glasgow G4 OBA, 0141 331 3893 > >Everything you need to know about publishing accessible information on the >Web. > >Connections Disability: http://www.connections.gcal.ac.uk/ > >Scottish Disability Information Mailing list: >http://www.connections.gcal.ac.uk/MailList/DisList.html From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Tue Aug 28 16:20:17 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Don Saklad) Date: Tue, 28 Aug 2001 11:20:17 -0400 Subject: Proper definitions. Distinguising News and Stories from each other. Message-ID: 1. How would you give proper definitions to the terms?... News Stories Defined properly, there would not be self referential use of the term in the definition as there is in the usual links for help. 2. How would you distinguish the distinctive features of the terms?... News Stories These seemingly simple questions need to be made completely clear with no ambiguity. From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Thu Aug 30 16:15:43 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Green, Geraldine) Date: Thu, 30 Aug 2001 16:15:43 +0100 Subject: Links Message-ID: Hi Jim hope you are well. Quick question - if I want to put links to other websites onto our site is it good practice to ask the other website first. e.g. other organisations that aren't GCVS members but useful site for members to look at. cheers Geraldine From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Thu Aug 30 19:53:34 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Johndan Johnson-Eilola) Date: Thu, 30 Aug 2001 14:53:34 -0400 Subject: links In-Reply-To: <20010830190121.D619A376F@lists.userland.com> Message-ID: [Geraldine asked] > Quick question - if I want to put links to other websites onto our site is > it good practice to ask the other website first. e.g. other organisations > that aren't GCVS members but useful site for members to look at. [This ended up being a much longer response than I intended; apologies. I'm not a legal scholar, but I've been active on intellectual property on the web issues for five or six years, so I've put some thought into this. The short answer is, no. But it quickly gets more complicated.] I'm adamantly opposed to this unless there seems to be some clear ethical, personal, or legal reason to do so. I'm *not* saying that you *never* ask permission, or that you never *tell* someone, only that you don't automatically feel required to ask permission. This probably seems like an odd set of hairs to split, but here's my thinking. First, large media conglomerates (Microsoft, Disney, McDonalds, InfoWorld) are tending to control their "intellectual property" voraciously. On one hand, I agree that authors (or their representative companies) should have a *certain* amount of control over the media they create. (I'm an author of print texts and profit from the fact that photocopying my work isn't widely acceptable--it happens, surely, but for the most part I get money when people buy my obscure little books.) On the other hand, there's a huge gap, both philosophical and legal, with the historical foundations of IP that separate "talking about" someone's work from "appropriating their work unfairly". If I'm prevented from linking to InfoWorld's website without first seeking permission (as InfoWorld briefly claimed last year), in effect InfoWorld is preventing me from providing readers of my critique of InfoWorld directly to their site. I would also distinguish just plain linking from hazier issues like deep-linking, in which the originating site sometimes provides link to a competitor's site that fool users into thiking they're still reading content on the original site. And this is even a little diferent than deep links that bypass higher-level advertising the destination site relies on for profit. (The answer to the former issue is a fraud charge; the answer to the later is using a database to serve pages and redirect incoming links to a top level, or something similar.) The purely ethical issue is, in at least this instance, somewhat easier to deal with: is your link going to cause undue problems for the destination site? For example, if I'm a high-traffic site (in my dreams), any link I offer to my users may be enough to swamp a site on a server with a small pipe. Or if I'm being critical of another site, I feel that I owe them a professional obligation to inform them of my link (and my criticism), just in case my comments are way off base. - Johndan Johnson-Eilola Clarkson University From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Thu Aug 30 20:02:06 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Ceelee) Date: Thu, 30 Aug 2001 12:02:06 -0700 Subject: links In-Reply-To: References: <20010830190121.D619A376F@lists.userland.com> Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20010830120004.00a56260@vs2.netalyst.net> Thanks for taking the time to give a full thoughtful answer. My first impulse was to just say NO. But I realized that in this case, more was better. -Ceelee At 11:53 AM 08/30/2001, you wrote: >[Geraldine asked] > > > Quick question - if I want to put links to other websites onto our site is > > it good practice to ask the other website first. e.g. other organisations > > that aren't GCVS members but useful site for members to look at. > >[This ended up being a much longer response than I intended; apologies. I'm >not a legal scholar, but I've been active on intellectual property on the >web issues for five or six years, so I've put some thought into this. The >short answer is, no. But it quickly gets more complicated.] > >I'm adamantly opposed to this unless there seems to be some clear ethical, >personal, or legal reason to do so. I'm *not* saying that you *never* ask >permission, or that you never *tell* someone, only that you don't >automatically feel required to ask permission. > >This probably seems like an odd set of hairs to split, but here's my >thinking. First, large media conglomerates (Microsoft, Disney, McDonalds, >InfoWorld) are tending to control their "intellectual property" voraciously. > >On one hand, I agree that authors (or their representative companies) should >have a *certain* amount of control over the media they create. (I'm an >author of print texts and profit from the fact that photocopying my work >isn't widely acceptable--it happens, surely, but for the most part I get >money when people buy my obscure little books.) On the other hand, there's a >huge gap, both philosophical and legal, with the historical foundations of >IP that separate "talking about" someone's work from "appropriating their >work unfairly". If I'm prevented from linking to InfoWorld's website without >first seeking permission (as InfoWorld briefly claimed last year), in effect >InfoWorld is preventing me from providing readers of my critique of href="http://www.infoworld.com/">InfoWorld directly to their site. > >I would also distinguish just plain linking from hazier issues like >deep-linking, in which the originating site sometimes provides link to a >competitor's site that fool users into thiking they're still reading content >on the original site. And this is even a little diferent than deep links >that bypass higher-level advertising the destination site relies on for >profit. (The answer to the former issue is a fraud charge; the answer to the >later is using a database to serve pages and redirect incoming links to a >top level, or something similar.) > >The purely ethical issue is, in at least this instance, somewhat easier to >deal with: is your link going to cause undue problems for the destination >site? For example, if I'm a high-traffic site (in my dreams), any link I >offer to my users may be enough to swamp a site on a server with a small >pipe. Or if I'm being critical of another site, I feel that I owe them a >professional obligation to inform them of my link (and my criticism), just >in case my comments are way off base. > >- Johndan Johnson-Eilola > Clarkson University From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Thu Aug 30 21:35:34 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Manila-Newbies@userland.com) Date: Thu, 30 Aug 2001 13:35:34 -0700 Subject: picture size Message-ID: I would like to display images using the "picture name with quotes". Is there a way to make the image smaller? Thanks, John Hughes From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Thu Aug 30 21:56:02 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Ken Dow) Date: Thu, 30 Aug 2001 16:56:02 -0400 Subject: picture size In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: John, >I would like to display images using the "picture name with quotes". Is >there a way to make the image smaller? The pictureRef macro will let you size the image. http://macros.userland.com/basic/pictureRef. HTH. -- Regards, Ken @ http://www.kendow.com The mystery of life is not a problem to be solved, it is a reality to be lived. - Van Der Leeuwarden From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Wed Aug 29 19:25:21 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Eric Soroos) Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 11:25:21 -0700 Subject: How to define stories. How to define news. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <228163901.1213038175@[216.39.167.34]> > 1. What exactly are the features of stories versus the > features of news?... A News Item is: a structured discussion group entry that has the following fields: Url, Title, Department, and Body. The news item may be in one of several states: editing, pending, or released. The news item format maps to the RSS 0.91 syndication format. Macros are not rendered in the body of news items. News items may be listed by department. A story is an unstructured discussion group item that has Title and Body fields. Stories differ from non story discussion group items in their display (no reply form, no list of replies, includes the skull link) and the permissions required to view them. (stories are always publicly availiable, unless the entire site is restricted to editors only. Non-story DG items may be restricted.) Non news dg items have macros in the body evaluated. A non-news, non-story dg item may be promoted to a story. > 2. What are some of the things to consider in choosing > one or the other?... If you want multiple discrete items on your home page each day that can be syndicated well in RSS 0.91 form, then use news. (Weblog style) If you write essays or other free form material, use stories. (Web Journal) Or use both. > 3. How would they be combined?... Stories do not have to appear on the home page to be useful. Unless you do custom programming, news items generally need to be on the home page to be useful. hth eric -- I create, therefore I am. From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Wed Aug 1 00:47:20 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (James Lee) Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 16:47:20 -0700 Subject: Newbie: Problems with my homepage Message-ID: <11EC3A0EF482D311ABD40008C7E64C7009D3132E@diana.portal.com> This can happen if you enable News Items but none have been posted. If you have News Items enabled, try disabling it and see if you get the homepage back. -----Original Message----- From: Lou Fox [mailto:foulox@yahoo.com] Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2001 3:40 PM To: manila-newbies@userland.com Subject: Newbie: Problems with my homepage My homepage is messed up. Here are my problems: It has a calendar for May 1999, instead of today's I have it set to show 7 news days, it shows today's date, and no news stories. But if I click on the archive button for today's date then it has the homepage the way I would like it to appear I have an editing form turned on for the home page, yet none appears. I've tried various themes none of them help What did I screw up, and how do I fix it? Any assistance will be greatly appreciated. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger http://phonecard.yahoo.com/ From Manila-Newbies@userland.com Wed Aug 1 02:14:09 2001 From: Manila-Newbies@userland.com (Brett Young) Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2001 13:14:09 +1200 Subject: help with site structure Message-ID: <005201c11a27$444824f0$250a0a0a@brett> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0053_01C11A8B.D97D04F0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Having trouble getting my head round this. Want to set up a site structure so that my pages(stories) all get rendered when I statically render the while site. =20 My understanding is that if I set up my pages in the site structure under a category (without its ownmsgnum) then: 1. new pages will automatically be added into the site structure and 2. all the pages will be rendered rather than just the home page (as at present) =20 so I did this for the navigation and site structure areas of the prefs: =20 =20 =20 =20 Main Page shows as a navigation link but when I press it I get=20 =20 Sorry! There was an error: There is no folder or object database named "mainpage" in the folder "C:\WINNT\Profiles\Administrator\Desktop\Frontier 6.2.1\Guest Databases\www\". =20 I must be doing this wrong (for sure)=85 =20 Can anyone assist please? =20 Brett Young =20 ------=_NextPart_000_0053_01C11A8B.D97D04F0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable